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In his years as a reality TV boss on The Apprentice, Donald Trump repeatedly demeaned women with sexist language, according to show insiders who said he rated female contestants by the size of their breasts and talked about which ones he’d like to have sex with.
The Associated Press interviewed more than 20 people — former crewmembers, editors and contestants — who described crass behavior by Trump behind the scenes of the long-running hit show, in which aspiring capitalists were given tasks to perform as they competed for jobs working for him.
The staffers and contestants agreed to recount their experiences as Trump’s behavior toward women has become a core issue in the presidential campaign. Interviewed separately, they gave concurring accounts of inappropriate conduct on the set.
Eight former crewmembers recalled that he repeatedly made lewd comments about a camerawoman he said had a nice rear, comparing her beauty to that of his daughter, Ivanka.
During one season, Trump called for female contestants to wear shorter dresses that also showed more cleavage, according to contestant Gene Folkes. Several castmembers said Trump had one female contestant twirl before him so he could ogle her figure.
Randal Pinkett, who won the program in December 2005 and who has recently criticized Trump during his run for president, said he remembered the real estate mogul talking about which female contestants he wanted to sleep with, even though Trump had married former model Melania Knauss earlier that year: “He was like ‘Isn’t she hot, check her out,’ kind of gawking, something to the effect of ‘I’d like to hit that.'”
The Trump campaign issued a general denial. “These outlandish, unsubstantiated and totally false claims fabricated by publicity-hungry, opportunistic, disgruntled former employees have no merit whatsoever,” said Hope Hicks, Trump’s campaign spokeswoman. “The Apprentice was one of the most successful primetime television shows of all time and employed hundreds of people over many years, many of whom support Mr. Trump’s candidacy.” She declined to answer specific questions that were emailed and declined an interview request.
Former producer Katherine Walker said Trump frequently talked about women’s bodies during the five seasons she worked with him, and said he speculated about which female contestant would be “a tiger in bed.”
A former crewmember who signed a non-disclosure agreement and asked not to be identified, recalled that Trump asked male contestants whether they would sleep with a particular female contestant, then expressed his own interest.
“We were in the boardroom one time figuring out who to blame for the task, and he just stopped in the middle and pointed to someone and said, ‘You’d f— her, wouldn’t you? I’d f— her. C’mon, wouldn’t you?'”
The person continued: “Everyone is trying to make him stop talking, and the woman is shrinking in her seat.”
Other cast and crew interviewed said they had positive, professional experiences with Trump, and added that they had never heard comments that made them uncomfortable.
“He was extremely supportive. You could tell there was so much respect there on all sides, especially with the female athletes,” said contestant and U.S. softball star Jennie Finch, a two-time Olympian. “Obviously, he was complimentary, but never in an inappropriate way.”
Contestant Poppy Carlig, who performed the twirl, said she considered Trump’s request “playful banter.” She added: “I don’t immediately jump to the conclusion that people are having bad intentions with what they are saying. He said I reminded him of his daughter and I thought that was really touching because I know how much he values his family.”
Twelve former contestants or members of the crew spoke on the record about what they described as Trump’s inappropriate behavior. Another nine spoke to the AP about their concerns regarding Trump’s treatment of female colleagues but said they did not want to be identified because they signed non-disclosure agreements, or were concerned about wrecking their careers or retaliation from Trump.
Most offered no opinion on the November election in the course of their interviews, but the majority of those who did said only that they were not supporting Trump.
Trump points to his record of hiring women, but he has often been accused of sexist behavior; at the first Republican debate, in August 2015, Fox anchor Megyn Kelly asked whether a man who has called women “fat pigs, dogs, slobs and disgusting animals” has the temperament to be president. After that debate, Trump attacked Kelly and her questioning, “You could see there was blood coming out of her eyes. Blood coming out of her wherever.”
The remarks of former Miss Universe Alicia Machado, who said Trump called her “Miss Piggy” because she’d gained weight during her reign, became campaign fodder last week following the first presidential debate. Trump used to own the pageant.
NBC, which broadcast the hit series, referred questions to executive producer Mark Burnett, whose studio referred calls to a public relations firm. The public relations firm did not respond to multiple voicemails and emails seeking comment. AP previously asked Burnett to provide original footage for review, but those calls were not returned.
Debuting in 2004, The Apprentice and a spinoff, Celebrity Apprentice, propelled Trump to national stardom following a string of bankruptcies and bad business deals in the 1990s that had splintered his New York-based real estate empire. The series, meant to showcase Trump’s business acumen, became a major hit and Trump’s name became a global brand that helped launch his political career.
But on the set, usually inside Trump Tower, the former cast and crewmembers say, the businessman’s treatment of women was sometimes far from professional.
Walker, who said she was the only high-level female producer during the first season, said Trump turned to her during a break outside of the control room to ask who he should fire. Walker demurred, she said, but noted that teammembers had told her one contestant had caused her team to lose their business task. Trump raised his hands and cupped them to his chest to ask whether it was a contestant with large breasts, she said.
“He said, ‘You mean the one with the’ — and he puts his hands out in a gesture to signal the girl with the giant boobs. He didn’t even know her name,” Walker said, adding that the contestant, Kristi Frank, was fired at the end of the episode.
“I thought he noticed my hard work, but I guess he didn’t,” said Frank, a former restaurant owner who studied industrial engineering.
She said that after Trump delivered his punch line “You’re fired!” he told her fiancé that “of all the girls,” she was the contestant he would have chosen to marry.
“It makes me a little sick,” Frank said. “It’s kind of sweet, but it makes me feel like ‘OK, he’s checking me out again.'”
In portions of boardroom sessions never broadcast, Trump frequently would ask male contestants to rate the attractiveness of their female competitors, former crewmembers and contestants said.
“If there was a break in the conversation, he would then look at one of the female castmembers, saying ‘you’re looking kind of hot today, I love that dress on you,’ then he would turn to one of the male castmembers and say, ‘Wouldn’t you sleep with her?’ and then everyone would laugh,” said a former crewmember who spoke on condition of anonymity because of a non-disclosure agreement. “There would be about 10 or 12 cameras rolling and getting that footage, which is why everybody was like, this guy just doesn’t care.”
Trump would carry on with the questions even if all involved were married, said Gene Folkes, who appeared on the program in 2010.
“If you didn’t answer, he would dig in and say, ‘Do you think so and so is attractive? Would you sleep with her? Well, what about if you really had to, would you?'” Folkes said. “It was so bizarre, because he (otherwise) seemed so professional.”
Folkes said he also remembered that Trump “asked one of the women their breast size at one point, or said, ‘are those real or natural?'”
Jim Dowd, who did public relations for Trump, NBC and The Apprentice shows between 2003 and 2009, said Trump was a “lover of women” and a “guy’s guy.”
“Was he complimenting the women? Of course. Was he behind closed doors with just the guys rating the women, who were the hotter ones on the show? Yes, he certainly was prone to that,” Dowd said.
“I never heard him say anything about women’s bodies, but he was definitely unscripted,” said former producer Michael Dietz.
Eight former crewmembers said Trump took a fancy to a particular female camera operator, and frequently gave her attention that made many on the set feel uncomfortable. Two former crewmembers said the woman made it clear to them privately that she did not like Trump’s comments.
Walker, the former producer, said it was clear Trump was attracted to the camera operator as far back as 2003.
“He said something like she was cute and she had a nice ass, and it was brought to my attention by someone else that he had a crush on her,” Walker said. “We all knew, so that’s uncomfortable in and of itself. I remember it being too much, that he made it obvious.”
Rebecca Arndt, a camera assistant who worked on the show following Trump’s 2005 marriage, said Trump would stop production to make comments about the camera operator’s looks in front of the crew.
“I remember being in the foyer once with eight or 10 cameras set up and he said something about her being so pretty,” Arndt said. “He would make it about his line of sight, like ‘There is a beautiful woman behind that camera, so I only want to look at that.’ It was supposed to be considered a compliment, but of course it was inappropriate.”
German Abarca, another former camera operator, said most of the camera crew knew that Trump was attracted to their colleague.
Abarca said the woman was the frequent subject of ribbing by others in the crew, almost all of whom were much younger than Trump. “I think she mostly tried to ignore it.”
Arndt said that Trump would publicly discuss the woman’s beauty and how her blue eyes and blonde hair compared to his daughter Ivanka’s looks.
“He would just mention it all the time. I remember him comparing Ivanka to her and saying that only Ivanka was prettier,” she said.
The woman did not respond to a voicemail seeking comment. The AP spoke in person twice with her husband, who said his wife did not wish to be interviewed, “doesn’t have a problem with Donald Trump” and denied she had been subjected to repeated, unwanted attention from Trump.
One former contestant, Tyana Alvarado, said she wasn’t offended when Trump told her she was attractive — but noted that he played by his own rules.
“Most men have to behave because they are in a workplace, but he could do what he wanted,” Alvarado said. “In all jobs, people have to sign sexual harassment paperwork, but Mr. Trump was putting on a TV show so he got to do it.”
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